Buying property in Ho Chi Minh

3POSTS

9 years ago

Hello
Looking for English speaking real estate agent and to get advice on buying apartment off plan. I am a U.K. Citizen.. thank you.

9 members reacted to this post

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Gareth Uk Contributor

161POSTS

9 years ago

Some further thoughts after your PM
Why do you wish to buy in Hcmc?...If you are not in a relationship,need to be in the city for work or any other reason there are better places in Vietnam....on the beach for example.The pollution in Hcmc is unbelievable.I need to be in Hcmc as my Vietnamese stepdaughter聽 works here otherwise I would move to Danang or Nha Trang
Your profile says you are in the Uk.....would it be better to rent an apartment before committing yourself.
Also from previous posts on this and other forums there are many pitfalls for a foreigner buying property even if you have someone here you can "trust".

2 members reacted to this post

Gareth Uk Contributor

161POSTS

9 years ago

Have a look at the current post " How do you invest in Vietnam Real Estate"
That should give you a flavour of the problems.

Charlottesc Member

14POSTS

9 years ago

I think there is pro and con of each country.聽 I think one has to do an in depth research.聽 Do not jump to the conclusion of everything by mere few examples of some unfortunates.聽 In many unfortunate cases, most of them were through private one man real estate agents.聽 Just a friendly exchange.聽 No offence. C

ajweissen Member

3POSTS

9 years ago

Thank you for the feedback

jazzy851 ViP

1487POSTS

9 years ago

Hello
Looking for English speaking real estate agent and to get advice on buying apartment off plan. I am a U.K. Citizen.. thank you.

There is another post on this topic, not specifically on buying off plan but buying property in Vietnam. You may wish to read that and see whether you still wish to buy or not..聽

Kooler42 Serial expat

210POSTS

9 years ago

Be very careful if looking at new builds. Vihomes Central Park has many quality issues related to workmanship and materials used.

OlegR Member

14POSTS

9 years ago

Thanks for your useful tips
I'm in process of making a deal with Vinhomes and also concerned about the quality issues - I've heard of them also here in Hanoi

Wxx3 Serial expat

409POSTS

9 years ago

#10

OlegR wrote:
Thanks for your useful tips
I'm in process of making a deal with Vinhomes and also concerned about the quality issues - I've heard of them also here in Hanoi

Please let us know how it turns out.

OlegR Member

14POSTS

9 years ago

#11

Wxx3 wrote:
OlegR wrote:
Thanks for your useful tips
I'm in process of making a deal with Vinhomes and also concerned about the quality issues - I've heard of them also here in Hanoi

Please let us know how it turns out.

Another thing is - can I own a flat having an expired visa (Residence Permit):
The present permit will expire in March 2018, whereby the last installment for the apartment is to be paid in the end of 2018...

Can I still rent it to somebody and possibly sell if required?

Wxx3 Serial expat

409POSTS

9 years ago

#12

Sure.
You can do anything you want until someone says you can't.
Doesn't get more simple than that.

Diazo Serial expat

948POSTS

8 years ago

#13

Which is key issue when wanting to buy here. Why would anyone want to buy in a country where they have no status other than as a tourist or a TRC. I wish I could count the number of times the rules/laws on these two have changed. Like the precious poster said " You can do anything until someone says you can't"
Until recently about all you could do is buy property for someone else with your money. In my own country where the protections are great I have no desire to even buy a car for someone else let alone a home. There is a rumor afloat that some marriages fail. So far I have not seen anyone end a marriage here in Vietnam, so at least there is hope. We do not enjoy that possibility in my country. Many many divorces end before one or both die.

OlegR Member

14POSTS

8 years ago

#14

Absolutely.
However the forecasts are that the Real Estate shall go up in value with the time here in Vietnam and that might turn out to be a good investment in future.
In any case one can also sell it back in case it is required.
Sure thing, with some amount of headaches as this will definitely require some efforts

Charlottesc Member

14POSTS

8 years ago

#15

If you buy it under the 'Foreigner' category, and you have not received the pink book yet (Ownership Certificate).聽 You can sell it to both local and foreigner.聽 You need to notify to the developer when you sell it.聽 Second, if you are the foreigner, you can rent it out as you have the same right as the local even you do not possess the ownership certificate.

Charlottesc Member

14POSTS

8 years ago

#16

In answering to the property forecast for the next 5 years.聽 You have to look at some development : the ongoing process of negotiating Free Trade Agreement with European regions,ASEAN, the Trans Pacific Partnership (TPP, hot topic that Donald Trump does not want to join); though it is an issue, it would be getting there in my opinion. The foreign direct investment has been going up and continuing this direction.聽 IT development as I knew one large French conglomerate invest a lot on female IT expert, Korean Samsung invests more this year, Nescafe is opening a factory here, there are lots of going on in this area, Ho Chi Minh.聽 If you do Buy-to-let, there are a market for renting to professional expatriates and ...

Wxx3 Serial expat

409POSTS

8 years ago

#17

Buy quickly.
Before you lose the deal of the century.

That's what you want to hear,聽 so now you heard it.

Diazo Serial expat

948POSTS

8 years ago

#18

Like is built on dreams I suppose. Sounds like some in this conversation have a bias toward their real estate day job. Still waiting for someone to show me a real estate purchase here, used as a rental with a respectable cap rate. I think I will be ancient or dead before cap rates came close to bond yokes or any other measurement of return. I think many here recommending this stuff have little clue about returns. Good thing I can rent the property even if I don't own it. I have seen many people who live outside the country and do not even realize someone has been renting out their house.
Heck here if you have joining homes you don't even have to pay for electricity. Just tap into your neighbors power while their away. Seen it happen more than once. Of course, this has nothing to do with buying here.

Charlottesc Member

14POSTS

8 years ago

#19

Sorry, if I offend anyone in how I feel for Vietnam market; I just did my research part.聽聽 No discussion from my part any more. Thank you. C

Wxx3 Serial expat

409POSTS

8 years ago

#20

You hit the nail on its head.

I understand the OP enthusiasm.聽
When I was younger and more naive I threw a lot of money away.
Now,聽 I still throw money away,聽 but at least i do it with the understanding it's not an investment, it's an entertainment expense,聽 like going to the casino.

Diazo Serial expat

948POSTS

8 years ago

#21

@charlottesc
Being in Cyprus and Scotland I can understand your research and enthusiasm for the Vietnamese real estate market. Get on the ground and research past the things that you feel will move the market and drill down into your status here and a entire host of other issues and we may not be so dreamy eyed about the market here. But you input is appreciated and has merit for some. But each persons situation is different. A VNese national is in a much different situation that an expat
here on some for of tourist visa. As I have written many times before you have no ownership of the land, you have no ability to research the title, get title insurance policy, common law to enforce contracts. But in the end when it comes to investing one must come the return against other investment vehicles. RE is not the most liquid investment one could have, and especially here. I would certainly like to see someone present the figures from real experiences that would support the idea that RE is a good investment here. But so far there has been no one come forward with any credible evidence.

haiwong Member

3POSTS

8 years ago

#22

Moderated by Priscilla 8 years ago
Reason : please post in the housing section
We invite you to read the forum code of conduct

jac87 New member

5POSTS

8 years ago

#23

Hi all, I hope to get some advice. I just spoke to someone from Giat Phat investment as I'm interested in the Masteri An Phu project but after reading the posts here, I am having deep consideration. Can anyone please advice what will be the complications if I use an agency?

Charlottesc Member

14POSTS

8 years ago

#24

@Diazo
Apologize, I have not been active at the forum for a while.聽 Yes, it is difficult to get some data from internet.聽 It has been wellknown fact that there is a lot of hidden record of Vietnamese people with abundant wealth would not show to the public .聽 Therefore, I could not present figures of who has made some fortune.聽 I do not do research of those; it is not of my concern.聽 But I do know people who have made profit in the early days from the period the day the July 2015 decree hit the ground.聽 But I would say that one should invest in only good location with reputable developers and always remember to get all paper/transfer slips of all transaction of the property in and out from the same bank.聽 We can only minimize the risk.

1 member reacted to this post

Wxx3 Serial expat

409POSTS

8 years ago

#25

And if you make sure to get "all the paper/transfer slips" you will have something to paper your walls.
Now that could be useful.

Jaygeefly Active member

26POSTS

8 years ago

#26

Hi,

I am a 60 year old Canadian and want to buy a landed property (house with land) in Nha Trang, my retirement home. Can a foreigner have free-hold title by buying off a local聽 owner and any issues about me reselling the ownership of house later? Any legal restrictions on ownership by foreigner? Any other issues I should b
e aware of? Really appreciate any info on the above.

Thanks in advance.

Jon

VuThang80 Member

11POSTS

8 years ago

#27

Jaygeefly wrote:
Hi,

I am a 60 year old Canadian and want to buy a landed property (house with land) in Nha Trang, my retirement home. Can a foreigner have free-hold title by buying off a local聽 owner and any issues about me reselling the ownership of house later? Any legal restrictions on ownership by foreigner? Any other issues I should b
e aware of? Really appreciate any info on the above.

Thanks in advance.

Jon

Hi Jon,
You cannot buy houses from a local owner, only can buy from the developer. And yes, when you are the owner, you can re-sell it later. Legal restrictions on ownership by foreigner is you process it only for 50 years, you can renew that once when it expires.

I am Canadian too, where did you live before in Canada?

Regards,
Thang

Jaygeefly Active member

26POSTS

8 years ago

#28

Thang,

Thanks for reply. I live in Burnaby, BC. I gather from your answer that Foreigner cannot buy free-hold land. Its 50 year lease-hold from developer?

If thats true, I assume that local VN cannot sell me their free-hold title? I am not interested to buy from developer as I want to negotiate with VN owner directly. As you know, Canada had no restrictions on foreign ownership of land.

Comments?

Thanks.

Jon

VuThang80 Member

11POSTS

8 years ago

#29

Jaygeefly wrote:
Thang,

Thanks for reply. I live in Burnaby, BC. I gather from your answer that Foreigner cannot buy free-hold land. Its 50 year lease-hold from developer?

If thats true, I assume that local VN cannot sell me their free-hold title? I am not interested to buy from developer as I want to negotiate with VN owner directly. As you know, Canada had no restrictions on foreign ownership of land.

Comments?

Thanks.

Jon

Dear Jon,
The law here is not as the same as Canadian's. You cannot buy from a local. You can only buy from the developer, or the property from another foreigner. So technically you still buy from the developer. 50 years ownership is provided by Vietnamese government.

Regards,
Thang

Wxx3 Serial expat

409POSTS

8 years ago

#30

Umm, This isn't Canada.
Have you read the hundreds of posts on this subject in the last couple years?
I'd start there.

But let me sum it up for you, you can buy anything you want. Meaning you give money and get ??? in return.
Now if you want your money back, that's a whole different story.

So I like to think of it as an investment in the future of Vietnam and Vietnamese.

Jaygeefly Active member

26POSTS

8 years ago

#31

WXC3,

I appreciate your answer and summary. Yes, VN is not Canada and thats why the average landed house in Vancouver is $1.5 million. Everyone wants to live and buy property here and its just its very expensive. Its a fools market as you can only get 4% gross yield from a $1.5M investment. I am a businessman, took my company聽 public, so am no fool. I go where the risk and reward is worthwhile for me. VN holds a lot of appeal but the risk needs to be managed. I ask a lot of questions to try to find ways to minimise the risk. I hope聽 members don't mind that for me, "NO" is not a good answer. "How" is what I am looking for. I did not make money by playing it safe nor accepting the wisdom of the crowd. Thanks.

2 members reacted to this post

Ciambella ViP

3482POSTS

8 years ago

#32

Jaygeefly wrote:
I did not make money by playing it safe nor accepting the wisdom of the crowd.

Nonetheless, you're doing the same thing as one or two other financial and real estate experts: coming to a public forum to seek information from the crowd, then rejecting their opinion while spending considerable time defending your/their stance.聽

4 members reacted to this post

GuestPoster678 Guest

0POSTS

8 years ago

#33

What was the name of the company you took public Jaygeefly? I may have something you might be interested in investing in. We do not have many here in VN with the experience level you have and it is great to have you here.

Jaygeefly Active member

26POSTS

8 years ago

#34

Thanks for your reply. I am not a real estate expert and know very little about VN besides the fact that I like the inexpensive cost of living and the vibrant lifestyle. My interest in personal RE in VN is to own an asset that can appreciate in value which can be sold or transferred to my family. It gives me an option to live there or rent it out for 10% gross yield (my expectation). As I mentioned, buying a house in Vancouver is fools game and putting money in the bank gets you 1.5% a YEAR which is taxable.聽 I come to this forum to do my research, to learn from the experience of expats, to equip myself with sufficient information so as to ask the right questions when I do meet local RE lawyers. I value all imput and comments and in no way reject any members personal opinion. I have lived as a corporate expat in many countries in Asia but not VN. I had never bought any RE property in those countries and now see that the RE prices has skyrocketed in those places I was
renting. I dont know if it is worth the risk for me to buy in VN so I keep asking for factual information.
Thanks again.

Jaygeefly Active member

26POSTS

8 years ago

#35

I am currently in Thailand and will be coming to VN in about 10 days or so. I'll likely fly to HSM before going to Nha Trang and Hanoi. Perhaps we can meet over a drink so we can discuss this further? I'll prefer not to talk about my public company in a public forum as I'm an insider of the company.

Thanks.

THIGV ViP

4427POSTS

8 years ago

#36

Jaygeefly wrote:
It gives me an option to live there or rent it out for 10% gross yield (my expectation). As I mentioned, buying a house in Vancouver is fools game and putting money in the bank gets you 1.5% a YEAR which is taxable.

Many people here have repeatedly come to the conclusion that it is better to rent than own.聽 Anecdotally, the apartment that we lived in sold for ~$17,000 just as we left in 2015.聽 We were paying ~$300/m rent which is about 21%.聽 However the owner had bought the unit brand new two years earlier for $25,000 so his return for rent was more like 14% and he had a capital loss of $8,000.聽 I'll let you do the rest of the math.

The Ho Chi Minh City expat guide

Comprehensive and free

Read it now

GuestPoster678 Guest

0POSTS

8 years ago

#37

@THIGV
聽 Very interesting facts. On an investment income level either of the figures you quote are quite impressive when compared to returns in America. If it just involved rental income I would be all over returns like that. San the loss on the sale. But I think that will happen quite regularly here.
聽 But the problem comes when you look at the initial investment. Here a foreigner, for the most part must pay cash. For locals VNese the banks have recourse and you can get a loan. So when you look at cash-on-cash return verses the same investment in America where the LTV is around 80% it is not a good investment for an American here. I have no clue about the RE environment and the LTV that banks are willing to loan at.
But taking the example cited by THIGV of a $17,000 investment it would cost me $3,400 to get into it. Now the numbers change dramatically. This, in part is why investing here is not good. Granted you still get the tax right offs on property here if your an America. Again I can not speak for Canada or other countries.
聽 So in my THIGV example would be great for a local, but for an American the returns would be far netter in his home country.