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Simplified Naturalization for Hungary

O
#1
Hello! I was wondering if anyone who has gone through the Simplified Naturalization procedure for Hungary could provide me with some information on what kind of documents are required?

Can you apply if your last Hungarian ancestor was your great-great grandmother?

I am struggling to find the birth records for her and her family. I have found the death records for her parents and the immigration record from 1902 for their entire family that states they were from Mramorak Hungary.

Since that region is now located in Serbia(?) I am at a loss!

Does anyone have any experience with this or think I have a chance at actually acquiring citizenship?

Thanks!!! :)
See also
reynoldsapples
#2
You need a lawyer.not so expensive out of budapest.

I know good one in keszthely zala county..
maybe cost 200聽 pounds.

She has done thousands.. of聽 hu聽 passports..
1 member reacted to this post
Z
#3
Mramorak is in Vojvodina, which was part of the Hungarian Empire until World War I. Thus your great-great-grandparents, if born in Vojvodina before then, would normally have been Hungarian citizens. If you are descended from a Hungarian citizen, even as far back as a great-great-grandparent, then you're entitled to apply for Simplified Naturalization. But remember, you have to demonstrate some competence in the Hungarian language as well.

You also need to show documentary proof of your lineage from a Hungarian citizen, and the starting point is normally a birth certificate of your Hungarian ancestor. In your case, that document, if it still exists, would now be in an official archive in Serbia, or perhaps held by a church.聽

It can take a great deal of legwork to track down that document.聽 Do you know your GGGM's birth name, including maiden name, her date of birth, and most importantly, the church parish of her birth, since that's how old birth records (pre-1900 or so) are organized? If you're going to have someone do this for you, then you might want to work with someone in Serbia, not Hungary, since that's almost certainly where the document would be, if it can be found at all.

Do you have your great-great-grandparent's Hungarian passport? If you can't get the original birth certificate from Serbia, perhaps -- perhaps -- that would be accepted as proof of Hungarian citizenship.

Once you have your Hungarian starting document, be it birth certificate, passport or what-not, you then need a complete chain of birth and marriage certificates demonstrating descent from your ancestor. Every document not in Hungarian requires a certified Hungarian translation.
1 member reacted to this post
O
#4
Thank you both for your replies! So far, I do know the names of my great great grandma, her parents, where they were born and when. I have looked through the church records provided on ancestry/family search.com and have not found any birth certificates. I was however, able to get in contact with a nice gentleman who had information on Mramorak and he was able to tell me some information about my family and their trade. Do you think that the death and immigration record will suffice or is it emperative to hire someone to dig up these documents?? What do you recommend is the best way to learn the level of hungarian they require? Thanks again for your help!! 馃榿
Z
#5
Would that U.S. immigration record declaring your GGGM's nationality as "Hungarian" be enough to serve as your starting document? I don't know for sure, but I can tell you that I have the same document, and when I showed it to the consul he was not very impressed. I think they really want to see a birth certificate. But in a pinch will they accept something less than that? Perhaps, I just don't know.

I'd be very reluctant to assume your GGGM's birth certificate doesn't exist聽 because you can't find it on Ancestry.com. Some things are there and some things aren't. Anyone who's done family research knows the twists and turns it takes: people living where you didn't think they lived, names changing that you didn't think were changed, records misfiled, etc.

To repeat, births before about 1900 were recorded by the local church parish, and are listed chronologically in the birth books kept by each parish. If you are absolutely certain of the birth date and the church parish, then all you need to do is look in the birth book of that parish for that date.

Family Search says "Transcript copies of registers exist for the province of Vojvodina and are found in the archive of that province." I'd say your starting point is to contact the provincial archives and ask what parish books they hold for births in Mramorak.

(The "birth certificate" for these old births recorded in church registers is simply a copy of the register page stamped by the archives, which you then have translated into Hungarian, if necessary.)

Remember that it only takes one ancestor who was a Hungarian citizen to qualify, so also look for your GGGF's records.

As to the language requirement, that's discussed in other threads here.
1 member reacted to this post
N
#6
Hi,
I am preparing students for the citizenship interview. (two of them have already passed it and have the Hungarian citizenship聽 :)聽 Both have gone through the Simplified Naturalization. One had an ancestor who was her great-great grandparent and as long as you can provide some documents (birth certificate, marriage certificate etc.) to prove the line, it鈥檚 fine.聽 Anything to show that they were your relatives is fine (no problem that at the moment that place belongs to another country) When they were born it was part of Hungary plus they were Hungarian citizens.
You can find some information here: allampolgarsag.gov.hu/ (in English down the page)
or here: washington.kormany.hu/simplified-naturalization
Good luck 飦� :)
1 member reacted to this post
O
#7
Hello!
Thank you so much for your response! I really appreciate everyone on this board being so incredibly helpful! Over the last week, I was able to find a few church records for my relatives and I was able to get in contact with some archives. However, my mom called the Los Angles consulate today and they informed her that the only documents they will accept are birth records and marriage records. They will NOT accept any church records. Were there any official birth certificates during the late 1800's? As far as I understand, the church was in charge of keeping these records during this time. If this really is the case, that would be a great disappointment. Any clarity or advice you can provide would be great!
Z
#8
As mentioned here before, consulates are sometimes not well-informed on the fine details of the Simplified Naturalization procedure. In this case, the official website of the Hungarian immigration office states that certified copies of church records are acceptable for births before 1895, when Hungary began to record births at government offices.

(last sentence, in Hungarian)

Note that these church records actually are legal birth records; before civil registration offices were established around 1895, churches were required by law to record births, and the church birth records had the status of civil records.
O
#9
I apologize if my questions seem repetitive! Just trying to make sure I understand the full process :) Did you have your naturalization approved? Since the people at the LA consultant DO seem misinformed would it be better to go elsewhere?

Another I question I have is in regards to the marriage record. The last relative I have that was born in Hungary put Austria on her marriage record (although her and her entire family were from Mramorak Austria/Hungary). Might that be an issue? Hoping this will all work out! Have been working on the details for awhile now!
Z
#10
Like most people here, I am still struggling with the Hungarian language. (Google Translate is very useful for translating websites.)

Why don't you ask the consulate again by email enclosing a copy of that website page? Calling usually just gets you an offhand response.

There always seem to be various inconsistencies in a chain of old documents. I assume the officials who review these documents are used to seeing them, but at what point these minor inconsistencies become a problem, I don't know.
RKinPA
#11
Hi Neko,

You mentioned that you are preparing students for the interview.聽 Would you be able to give me a quick overview of the process and types of questions they ask.聽 An estimation of how advanced your language skills need to be is what I'm interested in.聽

I'm in the process of completing my application for the Simplified process and have to do the interview.聽 I can handle basic conversation in Magyar but if it gets complicated or they go too fast I'm lost.聽 If we exchange pleasantries and a few basic questions about myself I'll be ok.聽 I'll be doing the interview in the U.S. btw.

Any helpful hints would be greatly appreciated.
N
#12
Hi RkinPa,
In order to submit the application for Hungarian citizenship, the applicant must be at an intermediate level in Hungarian. However, in my experience, this can vary depending on the place where you are interviewed. Some places take it more seriously than others. If there is a consulate, for instance, usually the consul will confirm the level of the applicant personally in an interview at the consulate, for which an appointment must be made in advance.
In the interview, themes like family and hobbies will be discussed. They are interested in your motivation, so why you need the citizenships as well as your knowledge on Hungarian culture.
The filled out forms and the necessary documents translated officially should be submitted then personally. They also ask to bring one photo with you as well as a document for identification which can be a passport, an identity card or a driver聮s licence. You can check and download documents from the first link. It聮s is always worth writing an email to the nearest consulate or embassy. They are happy to give information and send you the necessary forms.
You can find some information here: (in English down the page)
or here:
Here is the list of consulates and representatives:

Good luck 
In case you wish to practice the questions, you can reach me out. I teach on Skype.
Best wishes,
Niki
1 member reacted to this post
RKinPA
#13
Many thanks Niki. It looks like I have a little bit of language practice to do. I need to increase my vocabulary to include words relevant to hobbies, etc.

How can I reach you outside of the forum such as email or Skype should I want some additional help?聽 I'm new to the forum so I'm not sure how to send private messages or if it's even possible through the site.

Thanks!聽 Bob
1 member reacted to this post
fluffy2560
#14
I've noticed on the immigration web site that if you are over 60 you do not need to take the constitutional exam and by implication not the language exam as well.聽 Anyone know if that's the case about the language skills test?
Z
#15
I was told no exemption from the language requirement for Simplified Naturalization, regardless of age.
fluffy2560
#16

zif wrote:

I was told no exemption from the language requirement for Simplified Naturalization, regardless of age.


I see.聽 I think that has to be right.

The govt web site I was looking at seemed a little unclear. I was looking here and it says (in English):


The following persons shall be exempted from the examination [in constitutional studies]:

o persons with no legal capacity or with limited legal capacity,

o a person who graduated from a Hungarian-language educational or higher educational institution and he/she attaches to the application the copy of the certificate attesting the qualification or the diploma/degree, certified by a notary public or the institution which issued the document,

o a person over 60 years of age at the time of submission of the application,

o a person who provides proof that due to a permanent and irreversible deterioration of health he/she is not capable of passing the examination and he/she attaches to the application the statement thereof issued by the health institution competent according to the nature of the disease.



Further up it says:

The applicant must pass an examination in basic constitutional studies in Hungarian language.

Unfortunately, the way they've written it (in English), it could be taken that the HU language is not required if you are over 60.聽 It does not say anything about an on spot verbal test.

trollspinky
#17

niko42 wrote:

Hi RkinPa,
In order to submit the application for Hungarian citizenship, the applicant must be at an intermediate level in Hungarian. However, in my experience, this can vary depending on the place where you are interviewed. Some places take it more seriously than others. If there is a consulate, for instance, usually the consul will confirm the level of the applicant personally in an interview at the consulate, for which an appointment must be made in advance.
In the interview, themes like family and hobbies will be discussed. They are interested in your motivation, so why you need the citizenships as well as your knowledge on Hungarian culture.
The filled out forms and the necessary documents translated officially should be submitted then personally. They also ask to bring one photo with you as well as a document for identification which can be a passport, an identity card or a drivers licence. You can check and download documents from the first link. Its is always worth writing an email to the nearest consulate or embassy. They are happy to give information and send you the necessary forms.
You can find some information here: (in English down the page)
or here:
Here is the list of consulates and representatives:

Good luck
In case you wish to practice the questions, you can reach me out. I teach on Skype.
Best wishes,
Niki



Could you give more information in this Niki? Can you define intermediate level, how long it usually takes students to achieve it, etc? And which locations are more lenient on language in your experience?

Also, this is the first application submission appointment, correct? So you cannot submit your application and then learn Hungarian while it is being processed? You have to learn before you even submit the application?

Thanks!

Z
#18
"You have to learn before you even submit the application?"

That's my understanding. There's a box on the application: "Do you understand Hungarian?" Check "No" and I think they won't even accept it.
N
#19
As for intermediate level, you can check for instance the Common European Framework of Reference for Languages (CEFR) and at least level B1 is required for the interview. You can check the criteria at level B1 and B2. It means, in the simplified naturalization procedure, you must understand and communicate in Hungarian on a sufficient level, to be able to present the application for naturalization independently, without external help, and to answer the questions asked by the officer independently, even in short sentences. Of course, you can prepare for this , yet still you need to get familiar with the basic grammar to be able to construct your sentences.

It is hard to say how much time is needed, I have seen very hard-working students who could do this within a year, even like 6-8 months, however, on average I would say it takes at least one year. A lot depends on you and your motivations. I would say it is better to start learning before you start the process.

As for the differences, I would rather not write here my personal experience, however I am happy to tell you in private if you write me an email. (***)
Good luck 飦�

Niki
Moderated by Priscilla 9 years ago
Reason : do not post personal contact details here for your own security
T
#20
Hello, I was wondering if anyone has actually successfully obtained Hungarian citizenship through the Simplified Naturalization process?聽 We are currently going down that same path. Any tips welcome!
N
#21
Yes, I have had some students who have obtained it successfully. Check the Facebook group HUN Citizenship Journey and join them Plenty of tips can be found there. Good luck :D

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