Marriage fraud
need some guidiance and insight
thanks so much

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I personally know 9 such men ...
The women are usually either older and some times considerably or emotionally vulnerable.
If marriage is not an option then the motive is usually casual sex and requests for money usually on the pretext of an ill mother or such. Again personal experience of many ...
But there can be exceptions and I know of 1 very successful marriage .. both well educated professionals of a similar age .. with 3 children and married for about 12 years
He says when he's here he wants to send 100 a month home to cover his mothers medical expenses .
Leila999 wrote:I need help . I don't know if mine is fraud or not . I'm four years older , I'm in shape / attractive etc but he does say his mom is sick a lot
He says when he's here he wants to send 100 a month home to cover his mothers medical expenses .
Hello, Leila999.
I'm an Egyptian man myself. I have to tell you you have to be very careful while dealing with such relationships. I don't want to intrude here. I cannot claim to know everything. but caution is best.
I would be alerted if my partner mentions money right away even before we travel or meet (Sorry, I don't know if you did).
It depends on how long have you known each other and on the nature of the relationship.
Is he financially stable? so that he can guarantee sending the 100 he says he will? I mean, Why is he mentioning that? I'm just thinking with you out loud.
I am personally very suspicious of Egyptian men marrying western women. I am not racist or xenophobic, after all I married a Egyptian Muslim woman and I have some very good personal Egyptian friends. But the track record is not good. As I said before I personally know of many such marriages and 9 out of 10 end up with the woman getting exploited. I have seen a guy divorcing his Egyptian wife, marrying an Irish woman (15 years older) and sending money back to support the divorced wife on the pretext of supporting his sick mother and on his first trip home remarrying the first wife, which is perfectly legal and the Irish wife none the wiser. Now, I don't want to sow suspicion where there is no reason but the sick mother story is a recurring theme in exploited cases. If he is not capable of earning his own money and contributing to supporting you rather than the other way round and wants to send your money back home for his sick mother, I would be suspicious. Cultural difference run very deep, it is a very patriarchal society where the man is in charge, respect for women in general is low, where she does what her father tells her until she is married and then what her husband says and in general, women end up on the short end of the stick... and respect for western women is even lower. Now I am not taking a position on this one way or the other; it is just the way the society works and you just need to be aware of it and go in with your eyes open as you are not going to change it.
He states that he does not want to live anywhere but his own country and does not want to leave his family.
I'm not asking for advice as the decision and judgement must be my own, but would like to hear if any expats have had good experiences.
I am an Irish man who married an Egyptian girl 30 years my junior. we have been married 3 years and were together 2 years prior to that. I am now 59 and she is 29. We met in Sharm when I was Kitesurfing in 2012 and she was the manager of a French restaurant there. It was quite complicated getting married in Egypt ... for any foreigner marrying in Egypt ... and a bit more because I am a foreign man marrying an Egyptian woman plus the age difference which have specific laws pertaining to, and rightly so due to rich Arabs marrying poor Egyptian girls and subsequent exploitation.
We now live in Ireland and she is a Director in my business and as she has a good business degree, a good head and an excellent command of English and Russian she has taken to it like a duck to water.
We go back to Egypt about 4 / 5 times a year, Kitesurfing and seeing family.
Our marriage has been a great success .... in spite of all the Na Sayers and prophets of doom :-) ....
We got all the "she married me for money and I married her for sex" but we told them it was the other way around :-) ... She is drop dead beautiful and I do enjoy sticking it to people especially the looks I get from more mature women with men and groups of women in restaurants and hotels ...
Now we do get annoying hassle from time to time but you roll with the punches.
On balance it has been more acceptable in Egypt than in Ireland ... a cultural issue.
The main hassle I get in Egypt is from male relatives, they object .. as they see it .... to the amount of freedom I give Asmaa in respect to traveling where and when she wants and shockingly alone too, having control of her own money, not objecting to how she dressed and for not punishing her when she openly argues with them ... they cannot understand that I treat her like I would any western woman and say I should be more like an Egyptian man !!!
Overall it has been a great experience for us but Egyptian culture is 180 degrees to the UK in a lot of aspects ... it helps no end if you are rich ..and pure misery if you are not ... and is 10 time better for men than for women.
There are good men in Egypt who treat their wives well but they are culturally very different and as a wife I can guarantee some things will change. The way Egyptian men treat women before and after being married is quite substantial and if you are an Egyptian woman you know, understand and accept this. They cannot behave like a man from the UK no more than I can act like an Egyptian man, it is alien and not in the DNA ... if you understand this and enjoy this then you will be happy.
Now I am not trying to give you advice just how I see it from the inside and have experienced it, it is your decision.
Not sure where your man is from ... different parts of Egypt have different cultures and vary in conservatism ... Cairo being the most liberal other than Sharm
If you have specific questions or would like to chat to my wife your are more than welcome, just send me a message.
Regards
Ray
Thank you for taking the time to reply to my post聽 it is encouraging to hear your success, however as you say, you are living in Ireland whilst I would be living in Egypt.聽 My man comes from Luxor and during the time I have spent with him, I have nothing but good to say about him and also his family.聽 When he told his mother about me, she asked that he did not bring me to his family home unless he was in love with me and wanted to have a future with me.聽 She said that it would not be fair to me to do anything else.
I intend to go back to Luxor early next year for a couple of weeks for further reassurance.聽 My biggest fear being that at my age, with a good career, home, car etc, if the relationship were to fail and i had to return to England, it would be extremely difficult to start over.
I'm currently considering renting out my home or selling up and investing the money as a fall back.聽 Initially I had no fears about us having a future together, but almost every post I have read to date states that Egyptian men are fraudsters.聽 I'm certain there are an awful lot of bad men and women in Egypt, but this is true for every country.聽 There has to be good people there too.
I would welcome a chat with your wife if she can spare the time.聽 My man appears to have been open and honest, has told me he is a jealous guy,explained the cultural differences and has asked me not to be disrespectful to his family.聽 He also states that he does not object to me working although finding a job could be difficult.
I will be giving up a lot here, but I believe could also gain a lot by taking the plunge!
Thanks again Ray, really appreciate your comments.
We had a lawyer to get the approval.... I could never get the exact name of what he did, as his English, while reasonable, was not perfect.
The exact details of the rule were never fully explained to me, in the way I would have liked...
So I will give you what I know and please bear in mind, it is subject to clarification, may not be 100% and some of the rule could have changed since September 2014 when we got married.
The basic rule, and it is law, is that if the foreign man is more than (20, 25 or 30 ... never got full clarity on the exact number) years older than the Egyptian woman then the man must give the woman 40,000LE (could be more now). This money had to be lodged in a bank account in the Bank of Egypt (the national bank) in her name ... now it also was on a 10 year interest bond ... not sure if this is just how it happened or if it is part of the rule...
The lawyer than, had to apply for what he called an "excuse" (not sure of the exact legal term or where he applied, as it was never properly translated for me). This took about 6 weeks to get, as best I remember. I am not sure where he applied for it. When it was sanctioned we had to visit some government office (not sure of the name). Myself, my wife, her father and the lawyer met with some senior guy there and went through some papers. Her father had to sign some documents and as best I can remember so had my wife. There was also some money changed hands, under the table, I am not sure how much, or to who and not sure if this was to hurry things along or if it would not have happen without it; now the lawyer and my wife took care of the detail here.
This rule was made law a few years back and the reason was that there were rich old Arabs coming from Saudi and the Gulf countries, marrying poor girls, paying their father鈥檚 small money, taking them for 3 months and then either abandoning, enslaving or divorcing them. Basically exploiting them for sex and making them domestic slaves. There was a backlash and outcry from the public and the law was put in place to discourage the exploitation, make it difficult and the money is an insurance for the girl if she is divorced, abused or exploited. While it was difficult and cumbersome for me I would agree with the law.
So my advice is you should hire a lawyer. I would recommend you get one from a list available from your embassy. I would talk to a few of them and make a decision on who can speak the best English (if that is your native language), who understands fully what you want and need, and who will give you a reasonable price.
The lawyer we used was from Sharm, because we lived there before we were married (long story). He was ok but if I had it again I would have got one in Cairo, where all the work need to be done and I would have got one recommend by my embassy. He charged me $1,400. This was for guiding us through the full details of getting married. It was too much in my opinion for the quality of the work we got and he was learning as well. But you live and learn and it worked out in the end.聽
So in summary:
In my opinion you will need a lawyer who knows what he is doing
You will need to give the money to your intended wife and lodge it in her name
You will need to apply for the 鈥渆xcuse鈥
Your intended wife鈥檚 father or male family representative (uncle or brother etc.) will need to sign
If you need to speak to me or if your intend wife would like to speak to my wife Asmaa please send me a private message and I will send you my email and phone numbers 鈥 Both myself and Asmaa have unlimited international minutes聽 on mobile / cell phones or we can call using WhatsApp or Viber聽
Best regards and best of luck
Ray
To the best of my knowledge and I could be wrong, I did not believe it applied the other way ... if the woman is older than the man ... the law was intended to protect young Egyptian girls and not men ... In Egypt the man is the boss, the whole system is stacked for him and against women and men marry who they like and up to 4 women and can marry them with out telling the other wife / wives ...聽 but Egypt is Egypt and you never know ..
A couple of quick checks that you may be able to have your intended husband do ...
visit the office of the marriage court in Cairo (the only place a foreign national can marry an Egyptian)聽 ... there is only one ... and ask ..
If they say you are ok then no problem
If they say it is not ok ... I personally would not believe it ... go an get advice from a Lawyer first to check if it is so or not and if it was me I would get two to check as I don't trust the whole Egyptian system ... I certainly do not believe you are going to have to lodge 40,000LE in an account for him in case you divorce him LOL ...
Regards
Ray
Best Regards
BC
Not sure you orfi paper will be of use but you could bring it .. orfi's main purposes is as a law to fight prostitution and to ensure any children born will have a father named .. they don't have a major legal standing ..



I know that economy is very hard in Egypt and I just want him to be safe and happy we will always be close even though we will may not marry
What is your business in Egypt I hope you are doing well.
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